Home » Software » SpectraFoo » Spectrafoo 64bit (Upgrade?)
| Spectrafoo 64bit [message #87183] |
Wed, 22 May 2019 13:59  |
leetonne
Messages: 3
Registered: December 2015
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Junior Member |
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Hello,
are there any plans to rework spectrafoo to be compatible with upcoming Mac OSX versions?
Best regards
leetonne
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88469 is a reply to message #88414] |
Tue, 31 January 2023 09:16  |
mkap7
Messages: 10
Registered: January 2023
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Junior Member |
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Korey, I wish I shared your optimism.
Metric Halo has been jerking us around for YEARS now on this topic. I have been writing and asking about this update for longer than I can remember. I have asked for a timeline, even a rough one. Nothing. Longtime Spectrafoo users are obviously very low priority for this company. I am now looking to replace spectrafoo, since I cannot count on it any more. Raven Pro is actually a lot more powerful, just not quite as pretty sometimes as a live display. Spectrafoo does have the advantage of giving us a nice, clean display with nothing but the graph. Or, rather, it USED to have that advantage. As of now, it is useless.
And no, don't suggest that we run it in "parallels" - what an absurd suggestion. That was a reasonable temporary, short time fix....maybe in 2019.
Very disappointed in MH customer "support". We've been waiting for this update, and asking about it, for years now. How about a real timeline, MH?
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88470 is a reply to message #88469] |
Tue, 31 January 2023 09:18 |
mkap7
Messages: 10
Registered: January 2023
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Junior Member |
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At this point, Raven Lite is much more powerful than Spectrafoo. It works with 64 bit, non-antique hardware. And it is FREE. Why in the world should anyone consider paying hundreds of dollars for Spectrafoo when they can get Raven for free? Tell us, MH.
I've been a loyal user for a long time now, maybe 15 years. But I think I'm done.
[Updated on: Tue, 31 January 2023 09:20] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88473 is a reply to message #88472] |
Tue, 07 February 2023 00:09 |
bj
Messages: 621
Registered: July 2011
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Senior Member
Administrator |
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mkap7 ,
Sorry, but what kind of answer do you expect?
We've said we are working on it. We know that it is late, and that it is far from ideal. When we were asked earlier in this thread whether or not it is abandoned, we said "No. Its not, we are working on it".
You said that you've found a better solution, and are done with 'Foo. We are sorry see you go, but until we have something to ship, there is not much we can do - so what would be the purpose in responding. And perhaps it is too late to interest you. You have to do what's best for you.
Best regards,
B.J. Buchalter
Metric Halo
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88474 is a reply to message #88473] |
Tue, 07 February 2023 07:19 |
mkap7
Messages: 10
Registered: January 2023
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Junior Member |
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What kind of answer do I expect? Are you kidding? How about an actual timeline, with an actual expected completion date? How about some screenshots of work in progress?
"We are working on it"??? Ha.
If you really think that, after THREE YEARS OF WAITING, with absolutely NOTHING to show for it, "We are working on it" is a good answer, then you need to go back to customer service 101, because you are not good at it. THREE YEARS since your product has been usable on a current Mac operating system. For three years, we have heard "We are working on it". That is NOT an answer. THAT IS A DISGRACE.
There are in fact many companies in the world who make software. Most have done a far better job of adapted to a long-expected change. The switch to 64 bit architecture was NOT a surprise. Other companies have adapted with barely a hiccup. All of my other important software, maybe 100 different apps that I rely on, have made the switch. WHY HAVEN'T YOU?
Maybe you haven't officially abandoned Foo, but at this rate, you have IN FACT abandoned it, along with the users who paid good money to your company for a product they thought they could depend on.
The obvious conclusion is that Spectrafoo and its loyal user base is very very low priority for you. Thanks for that. This is not rocket science. Your website brags about all of your apple silicon compatible products. Why not this one? Again, clearly we are the lowest priority for you.
[Updated on: Tue, 07 February 2023 07:21] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88475 is a reply to message #88474] |
Tue, 07 February 2023 14:27 |
bj
Messages: 621
Registered: July 2011
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Senior Member
Administrator |
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mkap7 wrote on Tue, 07 February 2023 07:19The obvious conclusion is that Spectrafoo and its loyal user base is very very low priority for you. Thanks for that. This is not rocket science. Your website brags about all of your apple silicon compatible products. Why not this one?
Our code was Carbon based, and Apple dropped support for Carbon in 64-bit, so it required a complete rewrite (as did the Mobile I/O software and all of the Plugins).
While SpectraFoo was our first product, and very dear to our heart, it is not and was not the product that keeps us in business.
It would be wonderful if SpectraFoo had generated enough revenue to have dedicated engineering resources for it, but, alas that is not the case. So our engineering resources for moving our products to 64-bit and keeping up with the various compatibility changes had to prioritize the products that do support our company. Which is why all of our other products are 64-bit and Apple Silicon native.
As I keep saying, we are working on it and progress is slow but steady. If you use the MIO, you have seen a number of the elements of the SpectraFoo port within the MIOConsole3d software. But the full system is not ready to be discussed or demo, and the only way for us to have an actual timeline is for it to be ready to go (anything else is just a guess, and likely a bad one).
mkap7 wrote on Tue, 07 February 2023 07:19Again, clearly we are the lowest priority for you.
SpectraFoo is a high priority for us. We use it every day in every part of our business (we maintain pre-Catalina machines to run it). It is an even higher priority for me (personally) now that I am on an M1 laptop (due to my old laptop dying). But in terms of the development cycle priorities, our priorities have to be based on the products that keep our business running.
Luckily, the process of rewriting SpectraFoo to 64-bit is also a process of freeing ourselves (to a large extent) from the whims of the host platform, so we don't expect this sort of gap in availability to ever happen again.
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88476 is a reply to message #88475] |
Tue, 07 February 2023 23:47 |
dancardinal
Messages: 1
Registered: February 2023
Location: Boston
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Junior Member |
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Hi.
I've been monitoring this thread since 2019. It's heated up lately and I feel like I need to comment. I'm not here to insult anyone, because I think that's counterproductive.
I've been a SpectraFoo user since 2007 and it has literally been on a laptop to my left for the majority of my working career, initially as a touring FOH engineer but for the last 10 years in the recording studio I own in Boston.
My first email to MH support about a 64 bit version was in October 2020 when I bought a new laptop specifically to replace my 2011 MBP that had served me for so long. I followed up every 6 months asking for updates and always getting the "why" there's not an update, but never a "when". I know about the supply chain stuff, engineering resources, carbon, etc. In April of 2022 it was "hopefully in the months to come." Lately, my emails about Foo updates have gone completely unanswered.
I never assumed that Foo was a big income generator for MH. It's a very specific set of tools for certain types of engineers. It's not an interface, or a plugin, which have a much broader appeal (I also own 2 MH 2882 interfaces and the HDX Channelstrip plugin). And obviously it's a lot of work to completely rewrite software from scratch. And obviously everyone was affected by the pandemic. But you can't claim that SpectraFoo is a high priority for you, because that is demonstrably false. It may be a high priority within Metric Halo, because you need the tools for the other products you make. But you're also a software company, and so it's not a big deal for you to maintain dedicated 32-bit machines to keep Foo running while you run your business.
I'm also trying to keep my business running, and to some extent that involves your software. During the pandemic I had to find additional income sources because I couldn't have in-person sessions at my studio for almost a year. I started to offer mastering and was able to keep my studio open, despite going tens of thousands of dollars into debt. I have a well treated mix room and ATC monitors, but certainly not a mastering-tuned room. One of the reasons that I felt I could offer mastering to my clients was because I knew that Foo had my back for the things I couldn't do with monitors alone.
Am I dependent on SpectraFoo? Certainly not. I've been working without it for 2 years and I'm still here. Is it a core piece of my workflow and a serious tool that allows me to work quickly and confidently and deliver better products to my clients? Definitely. Is there a comparable tool available? Not that I've found. I've tried iZotope's metering suite but it doesn't run standalone and is generally meh. I'm currently using SPL Hawkeye and the spectragraph is truly unusable. It gives me a set of "hi-res" meters for my mix bus, clunky as they are, and a usable phase-correlation display. But for me, especially for mixing and mastering, it's all about the continuous spectragraph and that's really what I'm missing right now.
I'm asking you directly to give us a real timeline for when this will be updated. You keep avoiding answering, or stating that you can't say when it will be ready. And that is why it's not a priority for you. It doesn't generate enough revenue to throw people at it, and upsetting the Foo users wont put a meaningful dent in your revenues because we've already bought the software. It's a priority for you, internally, because you need it at Metric Halo, but you've figured out how to keep it running.
The rest of us have one or two computers which will inevitably die and need to be replaced. And right now, we're all in 64 bit land waiting for this software to finally catch up and be usable again.
Please finish the 64bit update so we can all get on with our jobs. You are harming your reputation for a small group of people and that may not mean anything on financial terms, but please know that this whole thing has been very disappointing.
Dan Cardinal
16-year Foo user and MH customer in general
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88478 is a reply to message #88477] |
Wed, 08 February 2023 13:39 |
bj
Messages: 621
Registered: July 2011
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Senior Member
Administrator |
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So fundamentally, at the end of the day, we know that we have let SpectraFoo users down, and we are really sorry about that.
We continue to work towards having SpectraFoo be available as 64-bit, & Apple Silicon enabled.
The 64-bit rewrite of MIOConsole took more than 3 years, and SpectraFoo is a product on a similar scale. Luckily SpectraFoo and MIOConsole share a lot of code, so we don't have nearly that much left in getting the job completed.
I guess that I will put it this way: from a business perspective (e.g. taking the steps required to be a going concern, and being able to provide a modern version of SpectraFoo eventually), we had to put the other products first.
As far as a timeline goes, even if we were working on it 100% of the time (which we are not, and cannot) I still would not be able to provide a timeline - there are still too many unknowns left. When this question has been asked in the past, we have answered truthfully based on the information we thought we had at the time, and we were clearly wrong. That's what I was referring to when I said "What kind of answer do you expect?" before.
Since I don't know when it will be ready, I decline to answer. Not out of disrespect, but out of respect.
Every time we give a timeline, we're wrong. So rather than make something up that is likely incorrect, I tell you the truth - we are working on it, and I don't know when it will be done. But it is a priority for us, not only to provide an update for our customers, but because we use it internally, and over time our workaround becomes as untenable for us as it is for you.
If it were not a priority for us, I would simply say - "hey folks, sorry - it isn't gonna happen." There are a substantial number of audio products that have met that fate (devices without drivers, DAWs that are stuck @ 32-bit, plugins that never got ported forward). SpectraFoo is not in that category. Its rewrite will get finished, and it will become available as a modern app.
Now, I am going to say something that will probably make some customers upset (which is definitely not my goal) and honestly is a statement against my own interests (which is getting SpectraFoo updated and getting everyone to update to the new version, not having customers spend money on other things), but I am saying out of practicality rather than ideology.
If you have a reliance on SpectraFoo, there is a straight-forward work around to the lack of a 64-bit build:
Dedicate a 32-bit capable computer to it - treat it like a standalone metering set. They are readily available and inexpensive. You might even still have the machine you used to use for SpectraFoo sitting on a shelf. But if you don't already have a 32 bit capable machine lying around, you can, for example get a 2012 Mac Mini to run it for $69:
https://eshop.macsales.com/configure-my-mac/UAEE1D59XX2XXXC
If you are on MIO 3d, you can even use SCP to route to it. If not, there are plenty of super inexpensive USB interfaces available today to get audio into the App.
This is not a long term solution, and we understand that you shouldn't need to have a workaround. But the fact is that 'Foo still works, and if you put it on a machine that supports it, you can use the software you paid for.
So to summarize:
'Foo is not dead.
There is an inexpensive workaround to use it today.
We continue to work towards a proper solution. We can't give you a date or a timeline that we have confidence in.
We know that we have let customers down on this transition, and we apologize for that.
We are doing the best we can, given the constraints we must deal with. If that doesn't work for you, I can understand that, but it doesn't change how quickly we will be able to get the rewrite completed.
I do appreciate the honest feedback, and hope to be able to do better for you folks in the not too distant future.
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88505 is a reply to message #88478] |
Fri, 14 April 2023 04:20 |
DanRock101
Messages: 15
Registered: October 2019
Location: Oxnard, CA
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Junior Member |
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This is EXACTLY what I've been doing, BJ. I have a 2012 MacMini running Mojave dedicated to running my FW 2D ULN8/2882 set up which includes my SpectraFoo license. It has worked fine and is still better sounding/functioning and is a better workflow than the Focusrite Scarlett I bought a couple of years ago. It's a small trade off as I wait to use my M1 MacStudio and MBA.
On that SAME computer, I have my UAD PCI Card with it's plugins, my Encore notation software, my Roland Vg99 software, my Boss GT software, and my (Intel) Windows Parallels which I still use to run my CorelDraw Suite <<< JUST TO NAME A FEW!
Metric Halo and Encore are the ONLY companies that are "future-proofing" their tech and looking out for their customers, or I should say supporters. They support our work, and we support them. I have made my frustrations heard here at the MH forums as well as on Gearspace, and I support people's freedom to air their grievances, ... I will now exercise MY freedom by choosing NOT to bitch at Metric Halo and their company who supports their supports UNLIKE UAD, Parallels, Roland, Boss, .... on & on & on ....
MANY companies have stopped supporting their own products and have orphaned their customers. I work in churches and schools, ... ever heard of Soundweb? Crestron? LONG GONE and they let the door hit us where the good Lord split us and didn't bat an eye!
Since MH started the 3D announcement, Apple has been on the upgrade every year and orphan their customers and previous models and software, ... this is all in the midst of the whole SUBSCRIPTION-GIVE-US-YOUR-MONEY-EVERY-MONTH-FOR-SOMETHING-YO UVE-ALREADY-PAID-FOR "world" ... Worldwide pandemics, financial crisis and looming wars and supply chain issues. Metric Halo and the rest of us have been doing the best they can, all while STILL delivering while not making us pay subscriptions or orphaning their products. THEY DELIVER!
Again, I CHOOSE NOT TO BITCH about a company who has done right by us for 30 years. 
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88506 is a reply to message #88505] |
Fri, 14 April 2023 09:46 |
mkap7
Messages: 10
Registered: January 2023
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Junior Member |
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Keeping a 10 year old machine to run one piece of software is a terrible, in fact insulting workaround, and doesn't exactly work for a teaching lab with 12 stations, does it? Also, some of us who work in Universities are subject to requirements about what systems are too old to be secure, and we can't even use them if we wanted to.
After how many years, this is the best that they can offer? Really? You call this "future proofing", DanRock? I call it blowing us off entirely.
"THEY DELIVER"??? Really? No. They DON'T deliver. They have not delivered. They have delivered exactly NOTHING to SF users as far as support.
This thread is four years old. Nothing has changed. Just promises, promises.
At this point, my prediction for the release date of the 64 bit update is......never. Not going to happen. Ever.
MH is just stalling until we either move on or die of old age.
Feel free to go on calling this awesome, though.
[Updated on: Fri, 14 April 2023 10:42] Report message to a moderator |
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88509 is a reply to message #88507] |
Fri, 14 April 2023 16:07 |
DanRock101
Messages: 15
Registered: October 2019
Location: Oxnard, CA
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Junior Member |
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WHOOPS! Forgot to mention ... I still have TWO 2006 & ONE 2008 MacPros, TWO 2009 MacMinis, 3 SantaRosa MacBook Pros all running Snow Leopard so I can use my ProTools 9 rig (which I paid for BEFORE their freakin subscription plan crap!) AND my original UAD Laptop Card (which will NOT work/unsupported with Mojave!!!!!) and ALSO to use my USB Dongle with all of my API & Line6 WAVES PLUGINS that went UNUSABLE when I upgrade to Mac OS Lion ... so I've kept these comps at Snow Leopard.
Only 3 of those 8 old computers were bought BRAND NEW by me. I've buying used OLD Macs in the interim years when I see a good deal (then upgrade them with OWC SSD's and max out RAM) as an old Mac, while locked out in Apple's douchee-bhag way from updating are still fine computers and great to have one in a classroom with an old interface that only works with an older Mac or that can used by ANY of my MH MIOs!
If I bought ONE GUITAR for ONE SONG, that'd be dumb. Find multiple ways to use your old Macs and multi-purpose them, and YOU (the user) along with your old computer won't be USELESS but VERSATILE! Yeah? No? Or just buy a new Windows comp every year along with a new interface every year and a monthly license for ProTools, a monthly license for Waves, a monthly license for UAD Spark ... You can do that too. I mean, I think that will probably make you happy, no?
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88511 is a reply to message #88508] |
Fri, 14 April 2023 16:12 |
DanRock101
Messages: 15
Registered: October 2019
Location: Oxnard, CA
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Junior Member |
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No, I was actually comparing an old Mac to a Fender Princeton, 50 year old Tele, a 60 year Neve board AND a 40 year old RADAR system, not just a Tele and amp. That is stupid for leaving out.
May I ask what interfaces and what software you use with your 12 brand new Macs in your class?
mkap7 wrote on Fri, 14 April 2023 16:03Did you just seriously compare a ten year old iMac to a 50 year old tele, or a 60 year old fender Princeton? That is stupid even as a joke. (Much love, of course.)
Did you miss, or just ignore the part about how I run a teaching lab in a university? We are not going to keep 12 old iMacs just to run SF. That is a ridiculous and stupid idea, and also not allowed by our IT.
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| Re: Spectrafoo 64bit [message #88540 is a reply to message #88539] |
Mon, 15 May 2023 06:13 |
mkap7
Messages: 10
Registered: January 2023
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Junior Member |
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What "news"? Did I miss some news? Because there isn't any on this thread, and hasn't been any news, at all, since you posted this question in 2019.
If you mean "We're working on it"........that's not news.
[Updated on: Mon, 15 May 2023 07:50] Report message to a moderator |
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